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Martin Luther has been called “the last medieval man and the first modern one.” Though raised in the distant medieval world, he has profoundly shaped our own. To understand better Luther’s impact on today’s church and world, Christian History talked with Lutheran historian Martin E. Marty, Fairfax M. Cone Distinguished Service Professor at the University of Chicago, and member of the editorial advisory board of Christian History . Marty is author of numerous books, including, most recently, the multi-volume Modern American Religion (University of Chicago).

Christian History: If Luther were alive today, what would he be writing theses about?

Martin Marty: Every historian says we can’t answer that kind of question, and then every historian answers it!

We have to remember that every historical figure is, in one sense, inaccessible to the modern world. Historian Heiko Oberman reminds us that Luther lived in a different world—a world of witches and unstoppable plagues. So it’s not easy to grab somebody out of his or her context.

That said, we can have some fun hazarding guesses. There’s no more consistent strand in Luther from 1513 [when he begins lecturing on the Bible] to 1546 [when he dies] than the gospel of forgiveness. That theme still isn’t heeded well.

In our day, we emphasize the gospel of self-esteem, marketing the church based on people’s needs, saying, “I found it!” and “I’m the little engine that could.” Our culture promotes human ability and human will, as did the indulgence culture in Luther’s day, as a way to bring salvation. So I have a hunch Luther would still feel compelled to speak his central message.

Would Luther quarrel with Roman Catholicism today?

The language of the sacrifice of the Mass, which disturbed Luther more than anything else, still remains. Yet there’s a hint of a whisper that today’s Catholic understanding isn’t that much different from what we mean in most Protestant Communion services when we talk about offering ourselves in response to the Lord. Within Catholicism today, there is less accent on the Mass being a priestly act of good works.

Also, when I look at Catholic teachings on the Book of Romans and the Book of Galatians, most of which acknowledge the critical role of grace and faith, I have to say Luther has made his point. I don’t know that he would be as disturbed with Catholicism today as he was in the 1500s.

At the Second Vatican Council, in our lifetime, the Roman Catholic church profoundly reshaped itself. If those changes had come at the Council of Trent, in Luther’s lifetime, would there still be one church in the West?

No. There isn’t ever going to be one church in the West. However much I may yearn for such unity, I don’t believe it’s possible in the modern world—a world of choice, diversity, rapid communication, and human autonomy. In the face of the many, many cultures in today’s world, I have no way of picturing something called the Western Church.

Is there any place, then, for Protestant-Catholic dialogue?

I think the most important Protestant-Catholic dialogue is what happens in Decatur, Illinois, and Dover, Delaware. It happens when people work in homeless shelters or do joint Bible studies or canvas their neighborhoods or jointly sponsor refugees. It happens when Catholic and Protestant seminaries offer cooperative courses. That’s when real dialogue occurs.

Where do you most see Luther’s impact on our world?

I don’t believe in the heroic concept of history, in which one person overshadows everything. I see Luther in the context of late medieval ferment: there is reform all over, and somehow a revolt in the junior faculty at Wittenberg is the one that catches on. Because Luther is a titanic character, he leaves his stamp on history.

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