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Christianity Today, August, 2007 |

Jerry Falwell Was Right

God really does judge the nations, new book argues.

Stephen H. Webb | posted 8/29/2007 08:43AM

Was 9/11 God's judgment against America? Pat Robertson and the late Jerry Falwell said so. They blamed God's wrath on abortion and promiscuity, and they were promptly skewered by the media—as much ...

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Stu Chisholm

Posted: September 09, 2007 4:26 PM

Robertson, Fallwell and now Keillor are looking at this tragedy through their own religion filters. This prevents them from seeing what plainly happened: fanatic religion caused 9/11. The hijackers who carried it out may have been many things, but no one can say they lacked faith. They had been taught that their actions were "what God wanted" and were confident enough in the promised rewards to willingly give up their lives. They had no doubts. We have Christians today that feel the same way, and will bomb a women's clinic or take up a rifle and kill a doctor because they're erroneously confident that it's "what God wants." Now Keillor is making the same mistake. Won't we ever learn? Trying to fathom the almighty is a risky business. Jesus taught that our faith is a personal thing: it is about our personal relationship with God. Not about killing, or even judging others. God doesn't use jet liners to vent his wrath. Learn the true lesson of 9/11. Give those deaths meaning.

moses

Posted: September 08, 2007 11:14 AM


i am scared why is all this bad weather falling on our red states is the world coming to the end is our ways coming back to haunt us why does the rest of the world and other americans dis like us are really greedy

tony	Posted: September 08, 2007 10:22 AM


it was refreshing to see some rational thoughts scattered in among the usual CT biblidiotic "commentary". The only thing this book and the review have evidenced is that possession of a PhD is not necessarily an indicator of intelligence.

superskepticalman

Posted: September 06, 2007 12:50 PM

Keillor, like so many others, fails in the essential exegesis critical to translating inspired scripture for contemporary application. He assumes that the United States of America stands in the same stead as the Israelites. This is obvioulsy false: we are not a nation of promise and, if we as Christians understand the New Testament appropriately, cannot be the case: we cannot take the place and advance the cause of the Kingdoms of Israel and Judah. We're not the new Zedekiah now able to accept and act upon Jeremiah's word, and it's not "anti-American" to object to this invalid hermeneutic. It's disappointing that IVP would publish such nonsense, but such a decision can safely be ascribed to the boys in marketing. It does make me think twice about buying from them as unquestioningly as in the past.

Bo	Posted: September 05, 2007 9:06 AM


The author and reviewer, and I suspect 99% of CT's readers, would benefit from reading Stanley Hauerwas or John Howard Yoder. All that we can say for certain about current American foreign policy is that violence begets more violence, and war (high intensity or low) is NOT the answer.

xyzwriter

Posted: September 05, 2007 8:24 AM

Yes, God does continue to judge the nations, but I think that we have to be careful of how we explain His action. God did not "inspire" Osama Bin Laden to attack America. However, when we turn from God, He can remove His extraordinary protection from us. God does not create evil and Bin Laden and his ilk are truly evil. This terrorist sees not only America, but the Judeo-Christian God, as his enemies. The fact that God may have removed His protective hand from America is perhaps a wake-up call for American Chrisitans to get involved in the cultural and social disasters in our country, but the attack on the Trade Towers was not God's will, nor is Bin Laden anything but a thug in the world.

Robyn

Posted: September 05, 2007 3:16 AM

If we research the history of what our allies did during the years of colonialism, and how we assisted them in the late 1950's and early '60s as they tried to crush those nations betting for their independence, I think we might realize that America HAS certainly done plenty to merit the wrath God promised in the OT, even to Israel, for oppressing the poor, and other sins we don't like to think about as pertaining to America. Go back and read Isaiah and see if both America AND the church are not just BEGGING for the wrath of God. In those days, God did use Israel's arab neighbors to discipline her. It is their decendents who terrorize us today. COULD there be some correlation there? I recommend watching 2 movies... Days of Glory and The Battle of Algiers, which highlight the events that led Algeria to become the birthplace of today's radical, militant Islamic movement, and both Algeria and Morocco are MAJOR training grounds for terrorism. These were eye openers for me!

Xeno77777

Posted: September 04, 2007 2:39 PM

I have no use for pretenders, who remove the good and relevant, and add their own biases to the Law and the Prophets. An Astounding 96% of Today's Seminaries teach the Graf-Well-Housen Thesis as True! It is a main cause of Atheism's Brazen Follies. Even God Denying time wasters, should see that politics and its ethics sub-branches make history unfold. But the followers or derivatives of Emmanuel Kant, Nazi Germany's Official Philosopher, know their fellow, Adolph Hitler, stated, "The Bigger the Lie, the more it will be believed, and the further and the faster it will travel," and do likewise! Christianity would do young folks a favor, by listing those 96% of Seminaries who teach the Imperial German Propaganda's Graf-Wellhousen Thesis as true, and the 4% of Seminaries who don't! Good Students will happily attend the 4%, and Free-Loaders happily, the 96%

Ian Stuart

Posted: September 04, 2007 11:59 AM


If God uses terrorist attack to "judge" nations then he is a very different God from the Father that Jesus described. I'm horrified by the very idea.

Charles Cherry

Posted: September 04, 2007 8:47 AM

"America exports Christianity as well as raunchy movies." Perhaps America should be ~importing~ more Christianity and exporting fewer raunchy movies. "America is not Israel, but it is not Babylon, either." Israel is not [biblical] Israel, either, and it is a mistake to conflate the two. Israel is a modern, mostly secular, nation. Just because they occupy the same land doesn't make them the same people. Read Paul: "For he is not a Jew who is one outwardly, nor is circumcision that which is outward in the flesh. But he is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is that which is of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the letter" (Romans 2:28-29 NASB).

Doug Indeap

Posted: September 01, 2007 8:20 PM

I stand dumbstruck at such utter nonsense being passed off as "a measured meditation on why God judges the nations." And what is the "method" of this so-called "analysis"? We are told the author "look[ed] for evidence of what the United States had done to anger radical Islamists" and "then ask[ed] if any of these items might also have angered God." Can anyone imagine a more intellectually bankrupt exercise? Leaving alone the absence of evidence that God exists, what possible "evidence" might be adduced to establish that God is angry or that his anger is prompted by the national acts and policies selected by the author or that there is any relationship between God's anger and the events in question (e.g., 9/11)? I can't possibly be the only one here to find it astounding that this is offered as a subject for serious discussion.

To bring us all back to Him

Posted: September 01, 2007 3:39 PM

Judgement mightn't be the right term. God said Israel had been given famine (clean teeth was the idiom) to bring them back to himself. It is not punishment in the sense of retribution because God is not a vindictive God. But it is a sharp reminder of who is in control when God has been forgotten. It is easy to forget God when the economy/trade is going well and there are many fat-cats. When a nation is blessed materially it thinks it can do without God and do what it wants. Also the world! But sometimes, like with the Hebrews a small number of people (the Hebrews were a small nation) suffered on behalf of all the world. Just like Jesus, being but one man, suffered for many, so America suffered so that the world can come back to God. It is a global issue and it will be wasted if people ignore the hand of God and ignore the call back to righteousness. America was a scapegoat like the Hebrews have always been, and like Jesus was; for a higher purpose. But there must have been just cause!

Deb	Posted: August 31, 2007 7:54 PM

Clay, I agree with you that God is merciful, but that he also sends judgement on those who rebel. As stated in his word, in Exodus 20:1-6 You shall not make for yourselves an idol, nor any image of anything that is in the heavens above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth: You shall not bow yourself down to them, nor serve them, for I, Yahweh your God, am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children, on the third and on the fourth generation of those who hate me, and showing lovingkindness to thousands of those who love me and keep my commandments. God is merciful to those who reverance him but cannot in any way condone the sin of the rebellious. If it weren't for him sending Jesus to become the bridge between God ( The Holy One) and us (the sinful, rebelious creation) we would all be lost to him forever.

John	Posted: August 31, 2007 11:24 AM


Why not blame the devil?He seems a more likely candidate. Or can't Keillor and Webb tell the difference? I am surprised to find support for this kind of thinking in this magazine. I had thought CT andits readers were beyond this type of thing. Evil men did 9/11, not God,not a supernatural force.

Brooke

Posted: August 31, 2007 6:26 AM

You say this in your article: "When disaster comes to a city, has not the Lord caused it?" These oracles, generally target nations that have mistreated Israel, something that can hardly be said of America." You may need to think and pray HARD about this one! Are we blessing Israel by sending them weapons year after year? Also sending money, which is used to fund their own form of terrorism against Palestinians? This IS mistreatment. So yes, in a way, America has mistreated Israel by doing these things foolishly. And furthermore, many scholars believe that Israel is meant to symbolize the church, rather than just a piece of land or territory.

Rose	Posted: August 30, 2007 8:58 PM

I totally agree with Kay's comments. This is a time of God's mercy granted to the world bacause of His great love, but is anyone interested in His mercy? Is anyone paying attention to what God wants instead of their personal beliefs on how to interpret God's Word. His mother, Our Blessed Mother has being warning us, especially in Medjugorje for 26 years now. Just like He used the prophets in the Old Testament to warn people, the Lord has been sending His Mother to tell us about His mercy and His love, but not many are paying attention. We, believers are the first ones to be called to witness. Are we prepared? Are we paying attention to God's will? When people who say are believers decide to make religion whatever they want, it seems that it is worse than a person who never understood the Word of God and never accepted it. A non-believer will be judged by the little they knew. A believer by how they used what they came to learn from the Word of God.

bishoplonnie.com

Posted: August 30, 2007 1:50 PM

I don't totally agree with grig's statement. There were times in the OT where the innocent suffered because of the sins of the guilty. Shadrach, Meshach, Abednego, and Daniel (forgive me if the spelling is wrong) were all taken in the Babylonian captivity. One only has to read Fox's Book of Martyrs to see how the innocent Christians suffered at the hands of sinners. Nor do I agree with the contention of one of the commentators that Rome declined because of Christians. I would suggest that person read "The Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire," by Gibbons. I think I am going to put the book on my must read list

TOM K

Posted: August 30, 2007 12:02 PM

This is perhaps the most rediculous article i've ever read. Mr. Webb mixes religon and politics and plays modern day soothsayer trying to devine Gods will from CNN instead of tea leaves. If a earthquake hits Sanfrancisco will we blame homosexuality or plate tectonics. Jerry Falwell and Pat Robertson are inflamitory and devisive charachters that reflect Jesus about as well as a mud puddle. U.S./western foreign policy in the middle east and terrorism is a cause and effect relationship that is pretty clear. Hurricane katrina wasn't any more than another hurricane during hurricane season in a geographic location that suffers from hurricanes what turned it into a disaster was neglect of the dykes and levies and then total failure on the part of the government to respond appropriatly, maybe it's easier for Webb to blame God than ourselves but it isn't true and for those who know GOD=Truth

BENTLEY

Posted: August 30, 2007 11:44 AM

I do NOT believe the correct theology is being used when describing God's Judgment. When God judges the penalty is Hell. We live in an age of grace. The natural product of sexual promiscuity or any other sin, when it is fully grown, is death. Death is the consequence of sin not a judgment. Sin must follow the law and result in death. God loves His children and wants to protect them from such consequences and pleads with us to follow His ways. Praise Him for His merciful grace to salvage us when we do fall and not judge us while we are alive.

JOHN W

Posted: August 30, 2007 11:13 AM

I don't think you can really say God directly punished America for any particular action. Nevertheless, actions and policies do have their consequences. "Blowback" is a CIA term meaning consequences of covert actions the public is not aware of (such as the overthrow of a democratically elected leader in Iran and replacing him with the Shah of Iran). If our country maintains 800 military bases all over the world and tries to impose our will on the rest of the world without having to be subject to the rules that apply to everyone else-surprise, surprise, there may be consequences to this sort of thing.

Kay	Posted: August 30, 2007 11:04 AM

Keillor states that America's founders were certain that their new country was chosen by God to play a providential role in the world. If you know anything about the messages given by Our Lady of America you will see how true this is. Our country has been blessed by God but we have abused His blessings. O.L. of America says that our nation had been founded on her Son. Our nation had a special devotion to her. Original explorers had originally named Chesapeake Bay, Bay of St. Mary; Montreal the Village of Maria and the Mississippi the River of the Immaculate Conception. Columbus and his crew sang and prayed the Salve Regina every night. L.A. was originally known by its full name, City of Our Lady of Angels. She warned us before 9/11 and she is still warning us to change our ways and return to God. She says our nation is to spiritually lead the world to avoid "a terrible purification". She says unless there was penance, God would visit men "with punishments hitherto unknown to them"

Liz	Posted: August 30, 2007 9:48 AM


When America (our government) has forcible removed God and prayer; then we no longer have his protection, because as far as He is concerned (by us doing this; we do not believe that he exist) He does not exist. When we put him back in our lives, only then will He protect our country. This is what our founding fathers believed in.

Clay	Posted: August 30, 2007 9:36 AM

Bernie, Tom -- have you read only half your Bible? The NT may be filled with the mercy of Jesus, but in the OT, God's hand of discipline comes down hard, often on his own people for their rebelliousness. If it were not for the fact that God must judge sin--hence the law of the OT--the redemption provided by Jesus would not be required. (And Tom, God often chose to use pagan peoples to carry out his discipline. In fact, if He is sovereign, it's not a stretch that we understand bin Laden's actions to be within the confines of God's will.) Also, I think the question needs to be raised of "special judgment" vs. "general judgment". God created the world in a way that there are often natural consequences to sin. Ask any alcoholic. But take, for instance, the AIDS epidemic: is that a "special judgment" from God on homosexuality and promiscuity? Or is it simply the natural consequence of sleeping around? Without special revelation from God on this matter, it will be impossible for us to know.

Bernie Kopfer

Posted: August 29, 2007 11:23 PM


So the God of love and mercy discovers that love and mercy don't always work out well, so He/She resorts to violence and killing to do what? Punish? Coerce? Get even? I cannot imagine Jesus killing off thousands of people in order to get His point across. Perhaps Mr Keillor can. And then we wonder why athesits have it so easy pointing out our inconsistencies and sometimes stupidities.

Grig	Posted: August 29, 2007 10:38 PM

Falwell and Robertson tried to squeeze a career bump for themselves out of 9/11. They should be ashamed. God didn't blow up the WTC, Muslim terrorists did. Are Falwell and Robertson claiming that every victim of 9/11 (even the babies) were guilty of abortion and promiscuity, or that God wipes out a group of people, guilty and innocent together, to make a point? Either way it boils down to saying God is a terrorist. Now I do believe that God has and will judge nations, but when God does that, things are much worse than they are now, destruction is total, and he separates his people out before his wrath comes. Case in point: Noah and his family (the only righteous people left) were saved from the flood, and Lot and his family were given a way out of Sodom. God specifically told Lot he would spare the wicked to preserve the life of the righteous and would not destroy the city if any righteous were left in it.

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