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Christianity Today, March, 2008 |

What Reveal Reveals

Criticisms of Willow's latest self-study do not undermine its value.

A Christianity Today editorial | posted 2/27/2008 08:09AM

Willow creek Community Church in Barrington, Illinois, has for decades been demonstrating how churches can more effectively reach the unchurched. One reason they remain leaders is their relentless passion ...

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Pastor C

Posted: March 09, 2008 10:59 PM

I've read the Reveal report, this editorial, and the comments posted to date. It seems that only the author of this editorial and Chris W have actually read the report. Chris hits the nail on the head, and the editors don't seem to have understood the point of the report. The rest of you should read the report before you say anything else. I'm no Willow fanboy, but I can't stand to read ignorant criticism of anyone. Willow's point is that they wrongly thought participation in their programs would inevitably lead to spiritual growth. Their survey showed that wasn't necessarily the case, so they're rethinking that approach. When they say that people need to "look beyond the church" and that "much of the responsibility for their spiritual growth belongs to them," they're not saying the church plays no role in people's growth; they're saying we can't expect to grow if we don't take an active role ourselves. Both we and the church have a role to play. Please read the report or stop typing!

Pete	Posted: March 05, 2008 10:10 AM

Part of the issue here is how we define church. There is of course only one Body of Christ – the church made up of believers all with different gifts and ministries that reflect Christ. When individuals with gifts come together as congregations, they often corporately express a particular gift. These congregations work together with others with their different gifts and reflect the fullness of the Body of Christ. We need to break the mindset of the expectation of one individual church (congregation) to provide an entire ministry to all believers. The Body needs to rejoice with Willow Creek for what is happening with its unique gifts. And, rather than judge it, what would be beneficial, is the giving and receiving of support from other parts of the Body with their different and complementary gifts whether in prayer or physical resources, that would enable this work to become more complete.

Jose L. Gonzalez

Posted: February 29, 2008 3:04 PM

I appreciate the balanced approach of the editorial. It seems to me that no church can supply the deep, life-long, increasing growth that we seek. God has ordained the family, the original "church" (two or three gathered in my name) as His model of love in human society. The Christian marriage is an exclusive, irrevocable and comprehensive covenant of three persons (God, who joins a man and a woman in Himself). It then becomes the primary source, the model and a school of spiritual growth, of how to concretely become Christ-like by learning to love.

Ron	Posted: February 29, 2008 8:38 AM

I have encountered too many pastors of '"seeker sensitive" style churches who respond with a "How dare you question what were'e doing" mentality even if you amiably question what they are doing. Sadly the same stubborn mentality over methodology that exists in traditional churches exists in contemporary ones as well. Everyone has their sacred cows even Willow Creek. Let's pray that sincere reflection can change stubborn hearts and minds..

Philip.

Posted: February 28, 2008 7:10 PM


"We're only troubled when such churches uncritically accept the metrics of marketing culture, and let consumer capitalism shape the church's theology." A valid point. May God send us a recession, so deep, so wide and so long, that those who seek God as a mean to riches would leave the church and, Christianity altogether.

Padre Dave Poedel, STS

Posted: February 28, 2008 1:53 PM

I have been watching the whole "seeker-sensitive" movement from afar (I happily serve a liturgical congregation), privately hoping and praying that their approach would "work" in inculcating unchurched and non-believers with the message of the Cross. While I doubted their methods, I saw the potential for these type congregations doing the "seed" work, and when the newness wore off these seekers would be led to churches like mine that offer a deeper discipleship, mediated through the Word and Sacraments. I saw us a Christian "graduate school". The trouble is that few got beyond "elementary school". While the seeker methodology doesn't work in my Church, my prayer is that all of us work together for the sake of the Body of Christ, the whole catholic and apostolic Church

Larry Wishard

Posted: February 28, 2008 9:23 AM

Re: Willow and Reveal The church, the universal body of Jesus Christ has delivered to us the gospel. In the oral word. In the written word (unless we can read Hebrew and Greek) we are indebted to scholars/translators produced and supported by the church through the years. Even the archeology work to learn the language has been supported by the church. To assume that an individual can do spiritual formation alone without the community of faith is indeed short sighted. Perhaps it would be better to say it is not a matter of going beyond the church, but to always know that church of Jesus will always honestly proclaim that personal responsibility for spiritual growth is essential. It is the job of Willow and all the body of Christ to train for personal spiritual growth.

Aquinas

Posted: February 28, 2008 9:19 AM

2 quotes from the article "The study's answer suggests a disturbingly low view of the church" and the next quoting from the conclusions of the reserach survey including the editorials emphasis And "We [at Willow] have to let people know early on in their journey that they need to look beyond the church to grow" (emphasis added). My Comment As has been obvously stated above and by many other scholars that much of Evangelicalism has a very weak Ecclesiology and has taken many of it's cues from the rugged individualism of our secular society. This leaves me with the option to believe that according to many Evangelicals that the church is an unessesary nessesity.

chris w

Posted: February 28, 2008 7:57 AM

I think the article misses the point. Willow are, I think, saying that people developing a reliance on cusuming the church programme doesn't lead to people growing in their spiritual journey to be closer to Jesus. They have realised that people must feed themselves too - they must seek God, not just go to meetings. So, interestingly, Willows research actually says that the consumerist approach to church is bad - you need to be actively involved. But not in the normal way we tend to think - getting involved in "church" activities, but by being involved in feeding from as well as feeding others. When viewed this way, I don't see it is incompatible with Pauls view of the church.

Graham UK

Posted: February 28, 2008 1:40 AM


I am seeking the deeper spirituality of Roman Catholicism centred in the Blessed Sacrament. The Society of Jesus (Jesuits) led me to salvation and true vocational change. My 'pastor' did not have an obligation to make me feel good my surrender to allowing the Creator to deal with the creature brought peace and joy.

CBob	Posted: February 27, 2008 9:35 PM


Churchmember to pastor(me): "You have an obligation to make me feel good."

Ron	Posted: February 27, 2008 8:05 PM

Although I congratulate Willow Creek and its staff for admitting this shortcoming the real proof will be if the church makes any radical changes. (Not subtle ones) Next they will have to communicate these changes to the thousands of churches that are now part of the Willow Creek Association. Sadly if the fixes are not made we will have more churches that are a mile wide by one inch deep and who have more people leaving out the back door than those entering into the front.

Gary Sweeten

Posted: February 27, 2008 7:01 PM

The comments by Bill H and others makes it seem as though growth in Christ is a solitary activity where one enters an auditorium with others but listens and learns alone. Then when they have come to Christ they grow by being fed, alone. After being fed for some years they should be fedding themselves, alone. I note that there are no tabs at CT on discipleship, community building and other growth issues. We are saved as individuals but live and grow in a community. Growth is sped up and we are challenged by the community. The community is called the family of God, a church or the body. It is obvious the the Willow gang knows little about Christian growth.

Steve Skeete

Posted: February 27, 2008 5:37 PM

I have no problem with someone saying that responsibility for a believer's spirituality belongs to the believer. It goes without saying that one has primary responsible for one's own growth. I however, have some difficulty when someone says: "We have to let people know early on in their journey that they need to look beyond the church to grow." This statement leaves me with many unanswered questions. One of them is what do you mean look beyond the church? Look where? Look to whom or to what? Another question is does the bible not say I should look to the church (that is, the body of Christ)? Is that not where I will find fellowship, friendship, counsel, iron to sharpen my iron? Is not the church the "pillar and ground of the truth"? What about the gifts of the believers? Am I not supposed to be taught, built up, encouraged, restored etc. through and by the church. Willow Creek ought not to be surprise if some of is members decide to keep driving, past Willow Creek.

IndyChristian

Posted: February 27, 2008 4:48 PM

Raymond... I second that. Someone show me any biblical subdivision of the Church at a city OTHER THAN geographic granularity... potentially all the way down to house to house. [not counting apostate groups, of course] And btw, when you DO find some other division... isn't Paul's saying "Don't do that anymore! No divisions among you."??? Our current model of driving by 9 churches so we can pick & choose our favorite pastor, biblical distinctive, color, age group, size, music genre, etc... is implicitly saying to our pastors... "Feed me, or I can drive by 10 next week." How do we EXPECT spiritual maturation, given today's (unaccountable) American Church model? Oh... and btw, how's our current American model of church working, anyway?

Raymond Takashi Swenson

Posted: February 27, 2008 3:26 PM

I just finished reading Viola and Barna's "Pagan Christianity", a critique of the conventional Christian church organization. One of their main arguments is that the church was meant to be organized in small groups that could meet in houses and in small enough numbers that every person could participate spontaneously within the meeting, without any formal direction from a professional pastor. They argue that this kind of 100% participation every week is the only way for Christians to grow, to "be all that they can be" (to quote the Army) or, as they put it, fully express Christ working through them. Whether you agree with their argument or not, it is a legitimate question to ask how conventional Christian churches are designed to bring individual congregants up to "the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ." Those who are pastors in some capacity get training and challenging, but Viola and Barna assert that the "laity" are trained to be mere spectators.

Esther

Posted: February 27, 2008 2:35 PM

Here is what has led me deeper and further into my Christian life and faith. First, the message of salvation; then a recognition of the gifts which Christ gave to the church. I felt my gift was teaching and applied myself to a personal study of the Old and the New Testament, making the application for today: incest (Judah) rape (Dinah) tattoos (Lev. 19); self rule as opposed to Christ being the Lord of my life (Judges 19:25); present day "idolatry" (many Scriptures);God's judgment; accountability to God and to people... From the NT came further lessons of how to live as a Christian according to the principles of the Gospels and the apostles' letters. In a recent rereading the Gospels, I see how far short I fall of the teachings of Christ. We need those personal studies and the pastoral studies from both the Old and the New Testaments. Many of these studies/lessons seem lacking today.

John Holecek

Posted: February 27, 2008 1:59 PM

I second Julie Ashton's comments. I made a Christian recommitment at Hollywood Presbyterian Church in 1982 and then served as a missionary with Underground Evangelism from 1984 until 1990. In 1991, I started attending a Catholic church and was received into full communion at the Easter Vigil in 1995 (previous marriages had to be looked at by a tribunal). As a commited evangelical Protestant, I always felt something was missing. That something is the Eucharist. Evangelicals try so hard with varied and always changing approaches to worship to make up for that lack, but there is no remedy short of entering the Catholic Church.

sphillips

Posted: February 27, 2008 1:59 PM

The challenge of meeting the needs of a broad spectrum of people is not new. A review of the New Testament, as it addresses the local church's mission/job, encompasses everything from providing for widows and orphans (Acts 6) to the training of church members to do the work of the ministry (Eph 4:11-16). The Church is to be there to try and introduce people to Christ, to assist them in growing and maturing to become Christ-like, and to motivate them to go out and do the mission that Christ has given every believer: To make disciples! The challenge remains and the mission has not changed. I appreciate the fact that Willow Creek was willing to look at how well they were doing and then be vulnerable enough to put that on stage for eveyone else to pick it apart. That in itself shows maturity (by the way I do not attend Willow Creek or one of its associated churches).

Sheryl

Posted: February 27, 2008 1:41 PM

Well you can tell by the responces that this article hit home to a lot of people. It is sad that I have to say that so many people of the Church are not getting what they are there seeking from Church and again it all goes back to the Pastors, Board, and Elders of the Church. The Board and Elders are there to make sure that Pastors are not out doing what they all of a sudden feels right. They are there for one reason and one reason only and that is to teach the Word of God...All of it. The Entertaining movement has left a bad tast in a lot of peoples mouths that are just enduring Church at this time. Also alot of pastors have gotten away from preaching and teaching the whole Bible. Not just the Gospels or the good, but that judgement will come & Hell is a real place.

Ray	Posted: February 27, 2008 1:23 PM

The major shortcoming in the seeker church culture that I've observed is that once the seeker has become a finder, there isn't much available to help them grow in maturity through being a follower of Jesus Christ. All too often, the attraction has been the pastor, not Jesus Christ. I recall one retreat setting where a participant announced he belonged to " Pastor Jim xxxxx's church," which made me cringe. In one church I was recently a part of, when the pastor was discovered to be having an affair with a woman in the congregation, many of the congregation said, "Why not just forgive him and put him back in the pulpit?" And they left to follow him elsewhere when the board wisely chose to terminate his employment as pastor. Their seeking had not been turned into Christ-following. Ray

Julie Ashton

Posted: February 27, 2008 1:22 PM

Oh, the self-assessments! I've been a believer for 60 years. Been a church-hopper, trying to find something more than friendship in the church. Been a Catholic now for two years, and it's the strong faith in literal apostolic succession, the actual blood and body of the Lord, and sacramental absolution which I discovered I'd been missing all those years. When you have that core, and can go to church every day if you wish, you are filled up, delighted, satisfied, at peace. Come to think of it, the phrase "The peace of the Lord be with you" is repeated, and not vainly, at least four times in the Mass. It's no wonder that the strong suit of the evangelical church is evangelism, but that once you've reeled them in, there is a definite problem . . . .

revronvegas

Posted: February 27, 2008 1:06 PM

Based on Ephesians 4 I'm convinced that the gifted leadership of the church is to provide the atmosphere for full-on Spiritual growth. How the people respond to the teaching, prophesying, evangelism, et al., is entirely up to the individual in concert with the proddings of God's Spirit. Some local churches are better at providing that atmosphere than others. That Willow and others would investigate their corporate (ie., "together") performance is gratifying and a sign of the church's inherent health.

Brian

Posted: February 27, 2008 12:45 PM

Willow Creek's study does point out the futility of going with the latest trend. Now Willow Creek is out and we're on to the Emerging Church approach. The gospel has always been transcedent in all cultures, languages etc...We don't need to "specialize" in meeting peoples "needs." Just look at how the church grew in Acts that's the biblical model. Willow Creek, Saddleback, Brian Maclaren & Mark Driscoll are only a flash in the pan when it comes to their philosophy of ministry approaches to the local church. And in many cases this is a dangerous approach because the parishioners are not being confronted with the gospel, sin and repentance. We can be creative without compromising the gospel. The lack of good preachers who clearly preach God's Word has given birth to these types of churches.

Leroy

Posted: February 27, 2008 12:14 PM

It's striking that this writer can state "the church is where each one is given a gift" and seamlessly (without thought) go on to quote Eph. 4:12–13, equating the "church" with the "body of Christ" as if that which passes as the (local) church, be it Willow Creek or another, and the "body of Christ" (universal) were the same thing. Willow Creek is what it is, ie, a seeker-sensitive church that employs the metrics of a marketing culture and consumer capitalism. Is this bad? Who knows. Who cares. Willow Creek, like every other organization passing itself off as a (local) church, is first and foremost a business! At least Willow Creek is honest about this, while most churches are not. It's time that believers of every stripe took charge of their own spiritual development and rather simply handing over their 10% in exchange for wholesome entertainment, used such funds to advance God's on going project to restore his creation based upon the finished work of Jesus.

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