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Christianity Today, April (Web-only), 2008 |

Are the Quakers Going Pagan?

The liberal end of the Society of Friends has long had members who denied God's existence or Jesus' divinity. Now hundreds of pagans call Quakerism home.

Matthew Streib, Religion News Service | posted 4/28/2008 09:14AM

When his partner died in 2004, Kevin-Douglas Olive reached a crossroads in his faith. Even though he had been a Quaker for almost two decades and put his trust in Jesus, he began to explore other ways ...

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Nels Hollo

Posted: May 09, 2008 10:51 PM


Steven said It better then I could. Thanks Steven!

steven

Posted: May 09, 2008 6:17 AM

Lost people act lost. Kelly, we don't seek God. He seeks us and his courting is made known by the Holy Spirit. Religion never has and never will point anyone to God. God created us from his own image and we have be trying to return the favor ever since . This is just more evidence of idolatry. If we would just humble ourselves and fall to our knees and ask the Lord to forgives us and REPENT. If we would just follow Christ along the streets of Jerusalum. Watch him as he is mocked, spit upon and beaten. He was naked, his beard was plucked he was fitted with a crown of thorns. He was taken to a trash heap ouside the streets and hung on a cross. All of this was to make a path to the one true God for those who would accept His forgiving Grace with a repentive heart. Now this behavior in the article would grow strangly dim. Now stand at the foot of the cross and look up. He loves you. He will save you. We also have the word. So then faith comes by hearing and hearing from the Word. Read it

Kevin-Douglas Olive

Posted: May 08, 2008 5:21 PM

Hi Friends I sometimes forget how much my frame of mind is shaped by my being Quaker since I was a kid. For me, the burning of candles and incense while praying is pagan. I have a colleague who is studying to be a deacon in the Orthodox tradition who I think would seriously disagree with the Quaker idea that candles, incense, and much of the rituals in the "high churches" is pagan. That Quaker view, which I've always held, may indeed be wrong. But it's my view. So, I pray in the name of Jesus, and even in the name of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit, but I have found that lighting a candles, chanting the psalms and burning incense helps my prayer life. Perhaps it is in error to call this pagan, but it outwardly resembles much of what I encountered in my brief foray into pagan traditions. However, it is not MY will (which is pagan philosophy) but God's will (Christian) who must be done. When I heard his call in my heart, I turned back to Jesus finding him with open arms.

Rini	Posted: May 06, 2008 2:35 PM


Only a very, VERY small handful of Quakers identify with being pagan and Quaker. (I, myself, am not one of them.) The majority of Quakers would consider themselves Christians. But as a whole, no, the Religious Society of Friends are not turning Pagan. And as someone pointed out, the author's choice in a title is very misleading. Truly, it is a small number of Pagans who are finding Quakerism.

Matt	Posted: May 05, 2008 9:24 PM

I can't believe the Quakers are allowing these Pagan dogs to commune with them. What does the kingdom of God have to do with the kingdom of Satan? Throw these Heathen dogs out on the street! We should never allow these servents of the devil to come into our church to bring in all sorts of ghastly doctrines from the pit of hell. Jesus is coming quickly, he better not find us in a drunken orgy (see Luke 12:45).

Ephrem Hagos

Posted: May 05, 2008 12:41 PM


I am looking forward to read an article entitled: "When Did Christians Go Pagan?"

Michelle

Posted: May 05, 2008 10:34 AM


One cannot be both Pagan and Christian. It sounds like the Quakers need to wake up.

George T.

Posted: May 04, 2008 8:28 PM


Regretfully your title is missleading. Quakers are "pure"Christians.

John	Posted: May 03, 2008 8:52 PM


Cath, your comments themselves show that the Quakers, or at least you personally, do not hold to the teachings of Jesus. Call it whatever, that's paganism.

Jael	Posted: May 03, 2008 7:07 PM


Quakerism and Christianity are incompatible, they don't mix, like oil and water.

James

Posted: May 03, 2008 11:44 AM


I went to a Quaker school. They have been going pagan for a very long time. Strange that it took this long to be noticed. I believe it will be the death of the Society of Friends.

Pr.bill borch LtCol.USAR

Posted: May 03, 2008 11:25 AM

The first Christians built a "fence" to protect themselves against sects/cults/ denominations; so people would know the church from what was just "opinions". They called themselves Orthodox- "right teaching." Rome "jumped" the "fence"- left ancient Orthodoxy- & changed the teaching. The Protestants left Rome; not returning to the "fence"' they simply flaked off all over the place. To try to make sense of all the cults/denominations is as sane as trying to empty the ocean with a teaspoon. If the "opinions" don't drive you nuts- you are. An Orthodox bishop attending a ministers' group heard each saying something like: Our view is- We believe- I think- The way we see it- etc, etc. The bishop said: "It doesn't matter what you think. I'm a bishop and it doesn't matter what I think. The only question is: what does "the" Church teach?" If you don't know don't waste your ink or our time. Quakers? They're no different from all the rest: no "fence". forestphilosopher.blogtoolkit.com

Adam	Posted: May 03, 2008 10:38 AM


So in essence they gave up worshiping God and seeing Jesus as devine. Instead they worship Trees and themselves. Now instead of worshiping the creator they worship the creations. Then they still say they are Christan to hide thier own guilt.

Kuni Lemmel

Posted: May 03, 2008 8:41 AM

Since we have the Word and the Answer, why do we not avail ourselves? Methinks we prefer despair. If not because we prefer despair, then it's unbelief and laziness; which is a preference for despair. Jesus has overcome the world, not we. Jesus has left us with peace, not saints nor the world. Jesus has spoken unto us that we might have joy, not the world. Jesus came that we might have life, and it more abundantly, not the world. If we apply and discipline ourselves unto knowing Jesus, though we may be afflicted, we can have peace, joy, and life abundant (John 14:27, John 15:11, John 10:10 KJV). If we don't, as Christians all we shall have tribulation; and hyphenated 'Christians' are double minded by definition and prefer tribulation.

Devon

Posted: May 03, 2008 1:09 AM

So CT, in your ever increasing dangerous tilt to liberalism, are you approving of this paganism in Quakerism or are you against making righteous judgements?? I see you don't make a call either way really! The road is narrow folks...very very narrow....such is truth... Man oh man...in the last days, even the elect if possible will fall away...CT...with your continuing articles showing abberant and appalling discernment, you are fulfilling the Bible perfectly!!

Brett Blatchley

Posted: May 03, 2008 12:15 AM

I had the pleasure of worshiping Jesus at a Friends meeting some years ago in Greensboro, North Carolina. That said, my mind and spirit are telling me that the trend described in this article is not of Christ. People are not being drawn to Jesus; rather they are fading into the nothingness of a formless, impersonal god (which is just a gentle path to eternal separation from the true God, Jesus). Quakerism is prone to this fading due to its gentleness, and it is being co-opted by non-believers who are growing an air of legitimacy by sucking it out the Quaker organization and its remnant of true Christians. I think that it is clear that soon Quakerism will become just another 'ism' and it will no longer be Christian any more than Yale or Princeton are Christian. It is another manifestation of the “great falling-away” at the end of the church age. It is sad, but Jesus said that it would be so; doubly so because the expression of my observation will probably be regarded as intolerant.

Patsy

Posted: May 02, 2008 9:57 AM


Quakers refer to their places of worship as "meeting houses" not halls. Please don't confuse Friends with Jehovah's Witnesses.

Charles Copeland

Posted: April 30, 2008 10:31 PM


"Both are non-hierarchical and place a strong emphasis on internal divinity." This is a false generalization. Some religions under the wide (I can't stress that word enough) umbrella of Paganism, such as Gardnerian Wicca and other British Traditional Witchcraft (BTW) groups have a rather rigid system of initiation and clerical hierarchy.

cath	Posted: April 30, 2008 10:29 PM

Most Quakers in the world self-identify as Christians, and many of those self-identify as evangelical Christians. We do not have a creed, relying instead on a personal relationship with God and direct revelation. So, it's not surprising that some Quakers will be Christian, some theist but not Christian, some pagan, and some "other.". My personal belief is that God is always leading us (individually per our own situation) to the place that is best for our own spiritual good and where we might do God's work on earth. To imply that Quakers are "going pagan" simple because some Friends have a spiritual POV that is not Christian misses the point of discernment of the promptings of the Holy Spirit. There is no take-over happening, no dire plunge toward the dark side. I would suggest that the author of this article become more familiar with the Religious Society of Friends. We welcome all who seek, including our Pagan members and attenders.

Noni Mausa

Posted: April 30, 2008 2:25 PM

As a Wiccan of 17 years, I can say that I was taught some Quaker practices as part of my training, chiefly having to do with quiet listening, and testing the leadings. Both core Quaker practices fit well into our practice (as they would, frankly, into most other religious practices.) As English adopts words willy nilly from other languages, so one of Wicca's core strengths is to adopt effective religious tools from other religions' "toolboxes". This has been the pattern from nearly the beginning of Wicca, and continues to be a sound strategy.

Tabhorian

Posted: April 29, 2008 9:14 PM

Its funny you should mention Carl McColman. Though he doesn't deny writing those books about Paganizm, he has pretty much gone way past pagan spirituality in daily life the last I knew. Now he favors Christian mysticism, and is not above cutting down Pagans occasionally, (like on today blog by calling spellcraft naive and superstitious). Carl founded "Brigids Well" a Celtic spirituality study group and led it for a few years, and then one day converted to Christian Catholicism. He led the group for a while longer, but finally left it in favor of becoming the webmaster for a monastary nearby, and since he could not abide the mixing of paganism with his new found religion. You can find out what he has been up to by going to his blog at anamchara.com. I am sure you will find it interesting. Carl is all that, no doubt. Brigits Well eventually disbanded. This whole concept should be interesting to my pagan wife who went to Earlham College. Now she can be a Quaker too. Hmmmm

Spatch3

Posted: April 29, 2008 3:12 PM

Unity and Quakers go hand and hand, and are usually Pagan friendly. I am a member of a Unity church and it has representatives from most faiths, and I have been an under the radar Pagan representative, even though no one has asked me about it. I do the drumming when the Goddess oriented crowd comes out of the woodwork. Even the pastor said that Unity and Quakers are two fingers rapped around each other spiritually. I once found a very nice Quaker site that showed how Representatives and Senators voiting on dozens of different bills in congress throughout "the hammer" years. On each bill the Quakers took a losing position 90% of the time. In looking at 50 or 60 positions on that many bills, I discovered I personally was lockstep with the Quakers. Who could have guessed a Pagan would agree almost 100% on an ostensibly Christian religious group? I think in the grander scheme of things, Quakers, Unitics (Unity members) , UU's and Pagans are siblings spirituality and ideologically.

Kelly

Posted: April 29, 2008 10:49 AM

A religion is either alive, relevent and pointing people to the divinity or it's the dead husk of one that used to do these things. If it is alive then by definition it's changing and growing, just like it's members. Luther, Calvin, Wesley, Fox, they all understood this. As did Jesus himself. All of these wise ones saw things they felt were wrong with religious establishment and sought to change them. What they may not have said, or what others didn't record of them, is that no matter the church you have to find god for yourself. If there are quakers that will use pagan ritual to reach out to God or if there are pagans who sit in meeting and reach for the light within, then at the very least they are doing it for themselves and according to their own concience. They are not leaving their souls in the hands of some priest. Well done.

Sergey

Posted: April 29, 2008 9:19 AM


All this is in the prophecies. So watch yourself these late days.

Reid Benito

Posted: April 28, 2008 8:06 PM

Dangerous, very dangerous! But we should go to them, welcome them, and embrace them with our love. Biblical Christians go where there's no light and gives salt where there's partial or no truth at all. Remember what Jesus said to the believing Jews, "If you hold to my teaching, you are really my disciples. Then you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free." John 8:32-33. Finally, whether their Christians or pagans, remember the Great Commission (Matthew 28:18,19), "...to make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age."

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