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November 23, 2009
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Home > 2009 > March (Web-only)Christianity Today, March (Web-only), 2009  |   |  
Soulwork
Lament for Lost Eden
What to look for in a real church.

Europeans came to the American wilderness looking for Eden, and Americans have been looking for it ever since. John Winthrop, one of the founding Puritans, framed it in terms of community. In his famous ...

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Displaying 1 - 13 of 13 comments.Page: 1     Show All 

Rick   Posted: March 09, 2009 2:19 PM
Wooo Hooo, Yea! Hallelujah! This is good stuff. I am so fed up with people bashing "the church" - which BTW is always "those other people - as though they are perfect in their love and care for everyone around them when their griping demonstrates they too do not have the love of Christ for God's people. It takes no discernment or spiritual insight to see and point out problems - pagans do that all the time. But it takes courage to get in the trenches with messed up people and gut out the Christian life with real folks, with real problems in a really sinful world. PS - Mr. set free because you have no clergy. Thanks for setting all the rest of us straight. What a relief that someone finally got it right and you are the one. (yes, read sarcasm in that). What a sign of the times. "Don't let anyone tell me what to do. We are all equal. No authority - spiritual or otherwise." Friend, it was God's idea, from the start to have appointed leaders (Ep 4). Call them what you like.

Christina   Posted: March 07, 2009 9:56 AM
I am moved by this article--it's a wonderful reminder of what Jesus called us to be as a body of believers....we're being made perfect with the genuine humility that comes with looking at other sinners and seeing the sin in ourselves....then accepting the forgiveness our good Lord gives us and, in love, forgiving others. Of course we'll become disillusioned with our churches!!! Just like we'll inevitably become disappointed in our spouses, but we grow, learn, forgive, and choose to love, over and over again....Thank you for this thoughtful and wise reflection.

Kris   Posted: March 07, 2009 6:43 AM
Right on target. Matt - this isn't hopeless pessimism. It's a call to accept one another as Christ has accepted us. The church is where we practice and learn the kind of love we are called to.

Ephrem Hagos   Posted: March 07, 2009 12:51 AM
How we yearn for the "ear full of corn"-harvest without even sowing the select seed in the field, is a perverse Christian joke! (Mark 4: 26-29). Desiring the "life" without the training of the "hard way and narrow gate" (Matt. 7: 13-14) will never work! Actually, ours is far from "the church that Jesus is crazy in love with" or is one with. Ours is nothing less than enemy of the church of Jesus Christ which is defined by his diacritical death on the cross (Matt. 16: 13-28 ff). Ours is a counterfeit and apostate church which does not, as it ought, know firsthand who Jesus Christ is! Ours is no better than the illegitimate "other woman"!

Chip Watkins   Posted: March 07, 2009 12:31 AM
Check out "Footprints in the Sea: Exploring the Disappearance of Jesus," by Ed Chinn, at www.coolriverpub.net.

Mark Galli   Posted: March 06, 2009 5:12 PM
Julia: Happy to mention your book. It is an honest book without being whiny. Sorry about the attribution. We'll change that. Others: Naturally, I'm speaking about the church at its worst, which we all get to see now and then! But it truly would be unbearable if it was only inquisitions and witch trials. By God's grace, even miserable churches have their moments of unalloyed grace.

Heather   Posted: March 06, 2009 1:16 PM
julia...if you would love the union salaries then you should organize the Wash Times...although the Rev. Moon would probably not be too happy about that.

Julia Duin   Posted: March 06, 2009 9:54 AM
Mark: Thank you so much for mentioning my book in your piece. I hope someone out there is listening to us "jeremiads" because the problem is real. One correction: I work for the Washington Times, not the Post. (although I would love the union salaries those Posties get!)

MP   Posted: March 05, 2009 9:33 PM
A very thoughtful essay. I think this problem has been exacerbated by the misguided view that the church can be "perfected" by the use of the right methods, techniques, leadership style, management principles, etc. In addition, there is the pervasive use of marketing strategies that identify people as consumers and customers rather than sinners redeemed by the grace of God in Jesus Christ. No wonder there is so much dissatisfaction with the church. God's gift of salvation, which draws us out of ourselves, has been replaced by our needs, likes, preferences, experiences, and everything else that maintains our place at the center of reality. No wonder people are unhappy with church and unwilling to commit themselves to others for working out their salvation as members of the body of Christ.

Matt   Posted: March 05, 2009 7:20 PM
What good does such hopeless pessimism do, might I ask? Contentment breeds apathy. To take the author's argument to its logical extreme, the Reformation should have never happened. If there is no hope this side of heaven for the church to "really" embody the values, principles, and mission of Christ, then the church is a lost cause, a farce. Leave the "real work" to the pious heralds—grit your teeth and speak the gospel.

so_free_me   Posted: March 05, 2009 6:46 PM
The problem with most churches is always the same: basic disobedience to God's Word regarding the distinction of clergy and laity. There is no distinction in the Bible and any church that promotes the separation (and very few don't) is simply wrong. Our church gave up on the clergy thing a few years ago and what a relief it is. No expensive programs to maintain because no man with nothing to do but dream up new programs around. Life is simple for us. Blissfully simple. We love it.

Bill R   Posted: March 05, 2009 5:33 PM
My attitude toward my church was reformed when I realized that the biggest problem my church had was very likely me, and people just like me.

Heather   Posted: March 05, 2009 3:47 PM
Great article. I always wonder why we look for a church full of saints when a look in the mirror should tell us we'll find a church full of sinners. Although I often wish our church had more modern music, more exciting bible study programs, spirit filled prayer meetings, I'm constantly amazed by God's revelation in the middle of a children's sermon time. Or the love that surrounds those who have lost someone. Or the discussions we have at Sunday school that seem to flow flawlessly with what's said in the sermon or what happens during the week. It's at times like these that I know I'm exactly where God wants me to be.

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