Today we spoke with Travis Collins. Travis was a senior pastor for 25 years as well as serving as a missionary overseas. His latest book For Ministers About to Start … Or About to Give Up is an encouragement to those who are following their calling, and those trying to remember they are called.
1) You've served in various roles in ministry positions, from pastoring to coaching to consulting. In your view, what is the single greatest challenge facing contemporary pastors?
The greatest challenge I find among vocational ministers is disappointment with the church. So many ministers envisioned far more that what they are experiencing.
They are disappointed by the way people have treated them (and no hurt church likes church hurt). They are disappointed that they have to do so much busy work merely to keep the machine running. They are disappointed that so much of their work seems so futile (at least on the surface).
That deep disappointment is a big reason for the epidemic of burnout, and perhaps is somehow behind some of the bad behavior exhibited by so many pastors.
2) The fall of Mark Driscoll has brought about fresh awareness of the perils of pastoral leadership. What warnings can pastors take from high-profile falls from grace like this?
For one, this is a reminder that the words, “I know the plans I have for you …” are not words of a pastor, but of the Creator. In fact, though I was never Driscoll-esque in my leadership, if I had my pastorates to do over again I would do more to draw out from the congregation what they were hearing from the Spirit about the church’s mission. I wouldn’t abdicate my spiritual responsibility as pastor, but I wouldn’t make as many pronouncements from on high either.
Furthermore—and this is not necessarily a warning for pastors—it is a reminder of the value of smaller, simpler expressions of church in which the shepherd and sheep know each other and do life together. Too much distance between pastor and people breeds megalomania among the pastors and naïve admiration of the pastor—pastoration—among their more gullible congregants.
So many ministers envisioned far more that what they are experiencing.
3) And yet there are thousands of young people every day entering the ministry, fresh from seminary or Bible College. What continues to inspire them to follow this "dangerous calling" (to quote Paul Tripp)?
If ever church ministry has been an adventure it is today, and there are lots of folks still signing on to join God in this audacious enterprise we call Christian ministry.
Interestingly, there is some concern now that the best and brightest seminary and Bible College students are going to prefer church planting over positions in established churches. Of course, it is encouraging that God is calling so many to extend his kingdom through new churches and fresh expressions of church. However, I believe God is not finished with our established congregations, so I hope many gifted new ministers will respond to a call to inherited churches as well.
4) There is so much talk about how difficult the pastoral role is, but you also talk about the joy of ministry. What are the spiritual benefits of serving in ministry?
In the book, This Odd and Wondrous Calling, Martin Copenhaver declared, “Being a pastor makes me a better Christian.” That is absolutely true for me. As a local pastor, there was the discipline of loving those I found difficult to love, as well as the support of those who loved me when I was not very lovable. There were (and still are) the stories of lives genuinely transformed—stories that, as a minister, I get to see up close.
And there are, candidly, the expectations that I had to live up to as a pastor. Trying to live up to those expectations always kept me praying, “Lord, lead me not into temptation, but deliver me from evil.” The ecclesiastical spotlight has probably kept many pastors from veering off course.
I believe God is not finished with our established congregations, so I hope new ministers will respond to a call to inherited churches.
5) If you were to offer one piece of advice to a fresh-faced kid out of seminary going into full-time work, what would that be?
When I perform a wedding ceremony I remind the couple before me (often two people who don’t know what they’re getting into) that emotions come and go, and what will get them to their 50th wedding anniversary will be a commitment to the sacred vows they are about to utter.
Likewise, I’ve gone through periods as a vocational minister when I didn’t “like” the church, and even when walking out on her was tempting, but I always chose to love her. And, like the richness that has come from my thirty-one years of marriage to Keri, my love for the church now has a beautiful depth that I didn’t know when I was fresh in vocational ministry.
So, my advice would be, choose and vow to love the church.
Daniel Darling is vice-president of communications for the Ethics and Religious Liberty Commission. He is the author of several books, including his latest, Activist Faith.
