An interview will determine whether this is God’s call only when it reveals the real story, when through it we discover the heart of the congregation’s expectations and hopes.
—Doug Scott
I took a deep breath to push the fatigue from my mind and body. After traveling seven hours to be there, my wife and I were now holding cups of strong coffee, surrounded by thirty people, and trying to connect names with faces.
They examined us closely, some smiling, some sizing us up like wary customers looking for a used car. Four months of correspondence, telephone conversations, research, and prayer had brought us to that moment. Every facet of my life would soon be explored publicly. I knew I would need the endurance of a distance runner just to withstand this evening. I was being interviewed.
The church, a major congregation in the South, was looking for a senior pastor. They had sent me a bulky package of materials—results of a congregational self-study, membership statistics, a statement of mission and purpose, and comprehensive financial reports for the previous five years.
I, in turn, had provided them with my background and experience.
We had planned our three-day interview trip with surgical precision—the children were with my parents in Philadelphia, the dog was housed at a kennel, the airline connections were engineered so my absence would not be missed, and other clergy were covering for me. It had been expensive and exhausting, but we were excited about the possibilities.
As we moved to our chairs, front and center, I prayed for discernment, knowing our conversations the next three days might well affect the rest of our lives. The chairman stood to begin the discussion.
Looking at me over the tops of his reading glasses, he said, “Before we begin, I want y’all to know I had to live up with the Yankees for a year back in 1965, and I didn’t like it one bit! What makes you think you’re gonna be happy livin’ down here?”
My wife and I exchanged glances and knew at once—it was all over.
That interview, at least, left no doubt about the congregation’s attitudes. That’s better than search committees and candidates performing a verbal dance trying to appear as attractive as possible in the ecclesiastical mating ritual. Often discussion is merely an exchange of theological pleasantries, with the tragic result that congregation and pastor don’t really get to know each other. At best, this means the first year is spent discovering the truth. At worst, such a flawed process makes everyone disillusioned when unexpected attitudes, ideas, and commitments surface only after the pastor arrives.
How can candidates improve the situation? Can the interview itself be a constructive and even enjoyable process?
Yes. Approached carefully, the interview is an effective tool for discerning the congregation’s expectations. The committee may not have thought back further than the former pastor’s resignation, and their forward vision may be limited to moving the new pastor into the manse. They may be mired in the moment, uncertain where they want to go.
Consequently, an interview will determine whether this is God’s call only when it reveals the real story, when through it we discover the heart of the congregation’s expectations and hopes.
The Approach
Upon being invited to interview, I make it clear that I’ll be asking a number of questions myself and that my questions will take at least an hour. I never assume that the search committee expects me to ask questions.
I was once the last of six candidates to interview with a particular church but the first to ask any questions. After our conversation, one committee member said, “We were surprised you had questions about coming here! We assumed our church was so attractive that any clergyman would be glad to come. I don’t know if you’re the right one for us, but you were the only candidate who forced us to think about what kind of minister our church needs.”
In particular, there are three types of questions I try to raise:
Questions of census discover who the congregation is—the talents, skills, interests, and commitments these people bring to church. Questions of census also look beyond the congregation itself to the area it serves. Does the church draw its members from the surrounding community? Have there been major demographic shifts in the past ten years, and if so, how has the church addressed these shifts? Do these trends indicate future changes? Is housing in the area affordable for young couples? If not, what is the potential for church growth?
Every congregation also has particular issues I need to know about. Some are low-risk, pleasantly discussed questions of theory; others are powder kegs. Is the church inward or outward looking? Have changes in worship practice disrupted the congregation? Was there (or is there) any contention over the previous pastor? Have there been theological or other divisions in the congregation? Has a building program alienated anyone?
Just as questions of census cannot be divorced from the community at large, neither can questions of issues. Has the school district been affected by busing? Is the community racially, economically, and socially integrated? If so, is the congregation? Are crime rates increasing? Candidates must explore the social context to understand issues within the church.
Questions centering on structures attempt to discover both the formal and the informal (hidden) networks in the congregation. But they also can probe beyond the congregation. Are relations with neighboring churches friendly? Has this church been involved with ecumenical worship, educational, or fellowship programs? Are there strong ties between this congregation and the district, presbytery, or diocese? If the congregation is nonaligned, is there an active clergy association in the community for fellowship and support?
The interview is the time for hard and honest statements. If I expect the church to increase my salary by 15 percent every year, this is the time to say so. If I will be disappointed by a midweek service of less than 50 percent of the congregation, I ought to explain that in the interview.
In the same way, I need to elicit the committee’s heart-felt, unwritten, but concrete expectations. Do they expect an eighty-hour work week? Do they expect me to be involved in the local community? The selection committee cannot represent all the congregational expectations, but they will probably suggest trends.
In addition, we must consider the relationship of our spouse to the interview process. Many clergy bristle when asked if their spouse will accompany them on the interview. Terse statements are frequently made (“You are hiring me, not my wife!”), which, while true, do not endear us to search committees.
Personally, I consider my wife a tremendous asset at a job interview. She has the ability to discern attitudes while I am embroiled in answering questions. In addition, she enjoys having the opportunity to meet the individuals involved—after all, she will have to live with them, too!
Before the Committee
As the interview begins, I ask if we might begin with prayer (if someone else has not already done so). If I pray, I let my prayer speak to the situation; I don’t try to impress them with my ability at extemporaneous praying. One honest “Lord Jesus, quiet our anxious hearts” will do more than an eloquent “Almighty and Everlasting God, we beseech thee of thy manifold and gracious favors. …”
I believe both candidates and committee are best served if the committee ask their questions first. That way, I can modify my questions to follow up on issues they have raised. My agenda includes not only my concerns but also ministering to their needs.
I usually preface my questions with a statement that some answers I am looking for are matters of fact, but others are matters of feeling, specifically their feelings. As a result, I realize there may be different answers to one question, and I welcome that diversity of opinion.
I find it helpful to have a list of prepared questions based on my understanding of the congregation, rather than appearing to ask questions off the cuff. The best kind of spontaneity, someone once said, is the well-planned kind.
While I may be tempted to deal with specific events, statistics, and services, I resist the urge to focus on too narrow an area. While there are no perfect “canned” questions for each interview, I take the following approach. Some questions may be useful as stated; others will need modification depending on the situation.
The primary purpose is to let me hear committee members express their attitudes and expectations. I have found it far more helpful to understand their likes and dislikes than their financial condition for the last ten years.
Questions to Ask
Why am I of particular interest to you?
I start with this question. I am not fishing for compliments, but it helps to know if they’re excited about me as their potential pastor. I also need to know why I am of real interest. The answer often surprises me.
I interviewed with one congregation who confessed (after I asked) that they weren’t really interested, but the bishop had asked them to contact me, and they felt obliged to do so. Once I knew that, I was able to focus completely on their needs. In fact, we were able to talk in depth about their situation. As a result, they clarified some issues in their congregation’s life, issues they had not recognized prior to my visit.
What has been the most significant event in the life of this congregation since you have been a member?
The question serves two purposes. First, I discover what events are significant to them, which helps both me and the committee focus on future expectations. In addition, I see what ministries this congregation considers significant. Do their responses focus on worship activities? Social functions? Outreach programs? Would I characterize any of those events as significant if they happened in my church?
Aside from the upheaval of looking for a new pastor, what has been the most upsetting event in the life of this church?
Unless this congregation is highly unusual, there has probably never been a public opportunity for members to express their frustration, disappointment, and anger. While they may have had plenty of private (and potentially divisive) opportunities, this question allows them to voice their pain openly. It also lets me know what is likely to upset them in the years ahead.
In your opinion, what areas of concern need to be addressed by this congregation?
Delightfully nonspecific, this question may be the perfect invitation for a committee member to open an issue that is unresolved or unrecognized. I must be prepared, however, to bring the group back to my agenda should they spend too much time on isolated concerns.
This question once evoked a heated argument within one search committee over a question of property maintenance. When we pursued it further, I discovered fully half the members expected the pastor to mow the church lawn in summer and shovel the snow in winter.
What kinds of things did your former pastor do particularly well?
Certain questions regarding predecessors are fair territory as long as I refer to them with respect and treat their ministries with courtesy and honor. In fact, if I’m kind in asking this question, it is appreciated. It allows those present to celebrate their former pastor in a specific way—by holding up his or her particular gifts in ministry. It also allows me to see what aspects of my predecessor’s ministry were well received, including tasks that may be expected of me.
What were the circumstances surrounding your former pastor’s departure?
I may already know the answer, having heard it through the grapevine. But unless the former pastor died in office, I find it helpful to let the committee state openly the reasons from their perspective. If my predecessor did die in office, or if he or she was extremely popular and moved on to another congregation, I will have to be sensitive to the committee’s need to mourn. If I am following an individual who had a long term as pastor, I may want to ask if the committee feels another long-term pastorate is feasible considering the tenure of the predecessor.
In what areas did you wish your former pastors had more expertise?
“We’ve had three preachers in a row in this church, and now we need a money man!” Listening to this response by a committee member a few years ago, I felt glad I had asked!
I cushion this question by making the subject plural, thus taking the onus off the predecessor, but I still allow people to express their opinions about unaddressed areas of need.
Two caveats should be issued: First, I am not talking about personality traits but ministerial skills. Second, I ask people to speak only about first-hand experience. Rumors that pastor Smith didn’t deal with poor Mr. Jones’s suicide very well may be nothing more than that—rumors—and are therefore counterproductive.
What formal and informal methods of support have you used in the past to help your pastor become a better minister?
This question may stop them cold! If they display signs of confusion, I explain that I need congregational support. Did they encourage (and offer to pay for) any continuing education? Are there formal structures to assist the pastor in preaching by providing disciplined feedback? Has the congregation developed methods to evaluate their own performance as Christian ministers?
Tell me about the governing board.
And I mean everything! How are they elected? How frequently? Does the board rotate membership on a regular basis? What is the background, business, and interest of each member? What kind of jobs do they hold? Are they employers or employees? (The answer makes a significant difference in how they treat their clergy!)
Who runs the stewardship, Christian education, youth, mission, and outreach programs? Who oversees building maintenance? Is the church board bound to any state laws in addition to congregational by-laws and denominational procedures? If there is a staff in addition to the pastor, who is responsible for church-staff relations? How much authority does the board exercise in staff management? How frequently does the board meet? How long, on average, do the meetings last?
The church building may be beautiful, the community ideal, the manse a mansion, but the quality of our working life will be determined largely by our relationship with the board. So before I consider accepting a call, I discover as much as I can about its members and how they function.
Has the pastor’s family traditionally taken an active role in this church?
In answering this question, committee members may reveal how they felt about the level of activity of previous pastors’ families. Therein lies the key to the criteria by which my family will be judged.
How is the pastor’s compensation package determined? How frequently is it reviewed? By whom? What factors are used in determining that package? Merit or cost-of-living increases? Social Security reimbursement? Equity in the parsonage or a cash equity allowance? Continuing education, book, and automobile allowances?
By this point, I usually know what salary the church is offering. What interests me now is whether I will participate in my salary review a year after my call. I also need to sensitize the committee to the increasing financial burden placed on clergy by factors beyond their control such as Social Security increases and the loss of equity by living in church-owned housing.
Far too often, humility (or embarrassment) prevents clergy from honestly discussing financial needs, but the laborer is worthy of his hire, and my compensation package must meet the needs of my family. My interest in the process and participation in annual reviews must be stated at the outset.
How should your pastor spend his or her time? In the course of a week, how much time should be spent in prayer? Personal study? Sermon preparation? Administration? Individual and family counseling? Visiting? With the family?
At some point, I get specific information about their expectations of my time. I remember asking a question about the rector’s personal time, and a vestryman responded, “Day off? Why, our rectors never take a day off!” I accepted the call to that church and found the man wasn’t kidding; they expected their rector to be available at a moment’s notice. It took two years before they became accustomed to my practice of leaving town a day and a half each week.
How many hours do they expect me to work in a week? If I expect to work forty, and they expect eighty, better to know it now! How are those hours to be used? When they are used up and work remains undone, what happens? If I work extra hours one week, will they allow me to take those hours for myself and my family the next week? Do they see prayer, study, and sermon preparation as part of my work week or things to be done on top of forty hours of hospital and home visiting?
As I question, I try not to sound judgmental; my tone suggests that I am merely acquiring information. They may have thought of the pastor’s job only in the most general terms. These questions force them to state their expectations clearly both for themselves and the candidate.
What organizations in the congregation are the most active or successful?
This allows me to determine congregational priorities. If the Ladies’ Bridge Club is thriving but the Young People’s Fellowship is limping along, I know where the interest and commitment is. I also ask if any organizations have dissolved in the last two years. If so, why?
Beyond calling a pastor and its related concerns, what is the highest congregational priority for the next twelve months?
Whatever the responses (and there are bound to be more than one), they will form my expected agenda for the next year. I must determine if their interests align with mine. I may want to build a men’s program or start an emergency food cupboard, but they may want to panel the church lounge or pave the parking lot.
What goals have you established for church growth? What methods can be used to achieve those goals?
The question of growth is a census question. Where will the new people come from? If this community is like most others, the question will be how to attract and sustain the unchurched. Is the church ready for that?
Perhaps the most honest response I ever received to this question came from one committee member who said, “Getting more people is your job, and I don’t care how you do it. I just come here to worship.”
While undoubtedly many people feel this way, if that attitude is embraced by the congregation as a whole, the task before me will be formidable.
What plans have you made for the expansion of staff or buildings?
If they haven’t planned for expansion, they don’t intend to grow. The vision of their future ministry is bound by the limitations of the present moment. While this may not deter me from accepting a position, I realize I have some hard work cut out ahead, beginning with an expansion of their horizons.
How financially stable is this congregation?
Even in the best of economic times, few churches are able to work toward future financial security. So I ask them to speculate aloud about the future financial needs of the congregation.
What programs do you plan to implement in the next ten years?
Many churches feel any plans they may have had go out the window when a new pastor comes. On the other hand, some congregations may be anxious to implement changes the former pastor disallowed. This question allows them to state their dreams for the future. I, in turn, can give them an honest assessment of my interest in those particular programs, and with relatively little risk.
But How Do I Know?
The search for the perfect congregation is futile. No church can ever fully meet a minister’s needs, any more than one minister can fulfill all the expectations of a congregation. Even so, I need not accept every offer that comes along. How do I know when to pursue an interview to the next stage or to accept the call if offered?
Accepting a call is at best a series of tradeoffs. I have to ask myself: Am I willing to live with this particular drawback in order to acquire that specific benefit?
Consequently, before we begin the process, we should take time to assess our professional needs and our family’s social and economic needs. We need to ask such questions as:
What are the non-negotiables? What are things I’d be willing to wait two years for? What are mere preferences? Do I have skills as a teacher that I need to use? Am I particularly gifted in youth work? Do I hunger to share my spiritual journey with a group of fellow pilgrims? What family needs will shape my decision? Will my spouse expect or need to work? What stage have my children reached in their schooling? Will their gifts or needs require specialized instruction or guidance?
In addition, we are wise to list areas where we will require assistance: Do I find administrative work a burden and hope to have members of the congregation share the load? Do I depend on lay assistance in visitation? Do I need structured feedback to help me gauge my performance?
An honest assessment of needs highlights specific areas the interview must address. If my needs assessment is carefully done, I’ll know what I require and what I’m willing to trade off.
The criteria I establish, however, may not be my final basis for deciding. I once interviewed with a church that presented me with a dozen reasons to say no. Some members of the search committee were guarded, others hostile. Several questions I asked received an answer I didn’t expect (or want). Accepting the call would have meant taking a cut in salary and moving my wife and children even farther from our already distant families. I was certain the pastor who accepted this call would be faced with a long list of difficulties.
But I accepted that call nonetheless and served that congregation many years. Sometimes a sense of God’s call overpowers us, so that we feel compelled to follow. In that case, these questions are asked not to determine a call, but to understand how we will enter it.
The interview, then, as stressful and upsetting as it may be, is the best forum for hammering out concerns, commitments, and priorities. The atmosphere is intense; expectations and hopes are high. But if handled carefully and prayerfully, the interview process can be a time of joyous discovery that leads to a long and fruitful relationship.
Copyright © 1991 by Christianity Today
