Jeff Hamilton: They made me go to school for 30 hours before I could press the automatic group button on the machine. And yet in 1996, they just handed me a baby.

Karl Vaters: Hi, I'm Karl Vaters and I'm a small church. And welcome to can this work in a small church? ...

Karl Vaters: Well welcome Peyton to the podcast. It's good to have you on with.

Peyton Jones: Thank you, Carl. Good to be here. You have

Karl Vaters: written a book called church plants, ology, and it is a hefty tome.

Peyton Jones: I'm not going to lie. There was 800 pages ...

Karl Vaters: So Jason, welcome today to the podcast. I sure appreciate your time.

Jason Moore:Glad to be here.

Karl Vaters: Now you started a ministry called Both/And, and with that title, it could mean virtually anything. So tell me what Both/And..., where did Both/And begin, ...

Matt Branaugh: We kind of consider it the ‘eat your vegetables’ side of ministry. No one loves to do it, but everyone should.

Karl Vaters: Hi, I'm Carl. I'm a small church pastor. And welcome to this episode of Can this Work at a Small Church? My guest today ...

Bob Roberts: I think cool is out. I think hype is over. People are looking for real. I don't care if you're big or you're small, they're coming to encounter God. They're looking for what's real. I think that's the biggest thing. And I think if pastors ...

Karl Vaters: Let us begin. So Gary, welcome back to the podcast. Let's take a look at what we're going to do. Last time we talked, we talked about longevity. We talked about your longevity at the church, my longevity at the church. And first of all, whenever anybody ...

Gary Garcia: I would tell pastors, man, stop chasing ministry and enjoy it. You know, that's one of the reasons I've lasted. I've enjoyed where I'm at. I've had so much fun doing ministry. Are there problems? Yes, we're, we're working with people. ...